fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

If you have made Upgrades and/or Modifications to your machine, let us know about them here.
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fred ungewitter
Posts: 356
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 2:55 pm
Location: East Central FL, USA
Country: USA
Nickname: fred
Laser Machine Make or Type: Redsail Clone
Laser Power: 60W
Laser Bed Size: 500 x 700
Home Position: TR
RDWorks Version: 8.01.18
Accessories: Chuck style rotary, 30 ma meter, home-spun office water cooler mod, muffin fan anti-condensate blower
Windows Version: Windows 7

fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by fred ungewitter » Thu Dec 29, 2016 7:14 pm

As some readers will attest, I've been trying to narrow down a recent failure with my fake 60w laser. Currently, I have a nice dry tube and no output. The vendor will not replace it under the alleged 2 year warranty in the eBay listing, no surprise there. That means I should perhaps replace the tube.

Unfortunately, I have yet to figure out if it's the tube that's failed, or if the tube and power supply have failed together. Either way, the following is up for consideration.

The current tube is a fake 60w, measured at 1000mm length. That means it's more likely a 40-45 watt unit. A real 60w tube measures 1250 mm and would fit in my housing with a 200 mm extension enclosure on the cabinet opening. If the existing power supply is not dead and gone, it's labeled 60w and should drive a real 60w laser tube. That would be great, but everyone likes More Power!

LightObject has two different 80w tubes, one in stock, the other on two week delay, which isn't all that much. One of them is 1300 mm long, the other is 1350 mm long. Of course, either one would require a power supply upgrade too. I'm inclined to stick with LightObject for the power supply too. I'm sure it's easier to get support response from the same continent, even if they are in a different time zone.

If I have to replace both power supply and tube, do I slip in a long 60w and gain about ten to fifteen real watts or really floor it with a true 80w tube, for an increase of perhaps sixty percent?
fred

Redsail clone 60w 700 x 500 REAL 60w Puri tube
home upper right, chuck type rotary 15000 pulse setting
RDW 8.01.18
Win7

Emblaser A3 4w diode laser
BCN3D Sigma Dual Extruder 3d printer
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Cube 3rd gen 3d printer, universal filament mod
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Keith Sherwin
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Posts: 1593
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:44 pm
Location: Heart of Canada
Country: Canada
Nickname: Keith
Laser Machine Make or Type: POS China
Laser Power: 80
Laser Bed Size: 400 x 600
Home Position: TL
RDWorks Version: V8.01.23
Accessories: Hot dog roller, doHICkey Power Meter, Multi-Lens, High power exhaust, Interior filter soon.
Windows Version: W7 Pro

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by Keith Sherwin » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:08 pm

Fred, there are a few considerations.
What will you be using it for? Do you REQUIRE an 80 watt unit or will a real 60 watt work for you? Do you need to do delicate work on paper or other low power work. Bigger is not always better, but then again, 80 watts is not huge power.

As for your other power supply, did you accidentally unplug the cable from the power supply? Very doubtful that the cable is not connected to the tube.

I would think the HV has dissipated by now. In the old CRT days, we would use a screwdriver with a wire to ground and just stick it onto the HV connection of the tube to discharge it.
:idea: Started this forum.
Lead in creation of the RDWorksLab English Manual.
Cheers, :D
Keith

Doug Fisher
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Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by Doug Fisher » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:21 pm

>>In the old CRT days, we would use a screwdriver with a wire to ground and just stick it onto the HV connection of the tube to discharge it.<<

The genesis of why you are now know as "Crazy Uncle Keith."
80 Watt 700mm x 500mm Ke Hui KH-7050 Laser (Similar to the Red Sail),T.R.
LaSea/EFR F2 Series laser tube, RuiDa RDC6442G EC controller, 2" lens, RDWorks v8.01.18, CW 5000 chiller, Chuck type of rotary attachment
Doug

Doug Fisher
Posts: 517
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2016 12:42 pm
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by Doug Fisher » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:23 pm

Don't forget about width of the tube. If you get a wider one, you may have to buy new tube holders/cradles. Also, make sure you current extension has enough space for whatever upgraded length you buy.
80 Watt 700mm x 500mm Ke Hui KH-7050 Laser (Similar to the Red Sail),T.R.
LaSea/EFR F2 Series laser tube, RuiDa RDC6442G EC controller, 2" lens, RDWorks v8.01.18, CW 5000 chiller, Chuck type of rotary attachment
Doug

User avatar
Keith Sherwin
Site Admin
Posts: 1593
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2016 3:44 pm
Location: Heart of Canada
Country: Canada
Nickname: Keith
Laser Machine Make or Type: POS China
Laser Power: 80
Laser Bed Size: 400 x 600
Home Position: TL
RDWorks Version: V8.01.23
Accessories: Hot dog roller, doHICkey Power Meter, Multi-Lens, High power exhaust, Interior filter soon.
Windows Version: W7 Pro

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by Keith Sherwin » Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:28 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol: No Doug, not quite. A good shock every now & then is good for one :!:
:idea: Electroshock therapy :lol:
When I did electrical, we would stick our fingers in light sockets, as a test, to see if they were working. As long as it was just on the finger and only 120 it was OK. The 347 was not fun to get a bite from. Almost got killed from one of them.

Then I got carpal tunnel in both hands and felt shocks all the time. Couldn't tell if they were real or just nerves. Now, that is very dangerous.
:idea: Started this forum.
Lead in creation of the RDWorksLab English Manual.
Cheers, :D
Keith

User avatar
fred ungewitter
Posts: 356
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 2:55 pm
Location: East Central FL, USA
Country: USA
Nickname: fred
Laser Machine Make or Type: Redsail Clone
Laser Power: 60W
Laser Bed Size: 500 x 700
Home Position: TR
RDWorks Version: 8.01.18
Accessories: Chuck style rotary, 30 ma meter, home-spun office water cooler mod, muffin fan anti-condensate blower
Windows Version: Windows 7

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by fred ungewitter » Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:26 pm

Keith Sherwin wrote:Fred, there are a few considerations.
What will you be using it for? Do you REQUIRE an 80 watt unit or will a real 60 watt work for you? Do you need to do delicate work on paper or other low power work. Bigger is not always better, but then again, 80 watts is not huge power.
Because I've not gone beyond cutting 3mm acrylic, at 15 mm/sec and 50 percent power, I don't have a solid concept of the power I really want. My aim, more or less, will be to cut 6mm plywood or thicker and acrylic as thick as I can manage. The keystone will be the plywood, then adapting to the thickest acrylic as a compromise rather than a goal.
As for your other power supply, did you accidentally unplug the cable from the power supply? Very doubtful that the cable is not connected to the tube.
Moments ago, in real time, I checked the power supply cabling. All wires are in place and the high voltage lead coupling is secure.
I would think the HV has dissipated by now. In the old CRT days, we would use a screwdriver with a wire to ground and just stick it onto the HV connection of the tube to discharge it.
Other matters prevented me from returning to the project as soon as I'd like, so I was assured of dissipation.

As noted in the other thread, the vendor has responded in a manner which leads me to believe a replacement tube will be shipped.
fred

Redsail clone 60w 700 x 500 REAL 60w Puri tube
home upper right, chuck type rotary 15000 pulse setting
RDW 8.01.18
Win7

Emblaser A3 4w diode laser
BCN3D Sigma Dual Extruder 3d printer
LMS Mini-mill
Cube 3rd gen 3d printer, universal filament mod
Under construction: OX CNC 1000x750 router

User avatar
fred ungewitter
Posts: 356
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 2:55 pm
Location: East Central FL, USA
Country: USA
Nickname: fred
Laser Machine Make or Type: Redsail Clone
Laser Power: 60W
Laser Bed Size: 500 x 700
Home Position: TR
RDWorks Version: 8.01.18
Accessories: Chuck style rotary, 30 ma meter, home-spun office water cooler mod, muffin fan anti-condensate blower
Windows Version: Windows 7

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by fred ungewitter » Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:06 pm

I've decided to find a real 60w tube to match my 60w power supply, even if the vendor comes through with the promise of sending a replacement fake 60w tube. Currently, my search has discovered from Rabbit Laser: http://www.rabbitlaserusa.com/WebShop/LaserTubes.html a 60w tube for four hundred american dollars. I've not pursued the expected-expensive shipping costs for a total purchase price.

I'd prefer to balance a good price with a US based vendor, although I would not reject a Canadian resource either. If anyone has suggestions for other vendors, please contribute.

If the eBay seller comes through with a fake 60w tube replacement, it would mean a tube for sale here, with a faster delivery time for the recipient. I'm hoping the eBay seller doesn't plan to hit me with shipping from China!
fred

Redsail clone 60w 700 x 500 REAL 60w Puri tube
home upper right, chuck type rotary 15000 pulse setting
RDW 8.01.18
Win7

Emblaser A3 4w diode laser
BCN3D Sigma Dual Extruder 3d printer
LMS Mini-mill
Cube 3rd gen 3d printer, universal filament mod
Under construction: OX CNC 1000x750 router

Dustin Hawkinson
Posts: 158
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2016 6:55 pm
Location: Phoenix, AZ USA

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by Dustin Hawkinson » Wed Jan 04, 2017 7:45 pm

fred ungewitter wrote:If the eBay seller comes through with a fake 60w tube replacement, it would mean a tube for sale here, with a faster delivery time for the recipient. I'm hoping the eBay seller doesn't plan to hit me with shipping from China!
I hope not either. I haven't heard back on my offer to accept a partial refund, so we'll see. Where did you hear about rabbit laser? I haven't heard of them but having more US suppliers will be nice.
40W (ebay 50W blue wonder), 300mm x 500m, TL
Windows10 RDW 8.01.19
(The member formerly known as astral)
-Dustin

Doug Fisher
Posts: 517
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2016 12:42 pm
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by Doug Fisher » Wed Jan 04, 2017 7:55 pm

Rabbit Laser USA is out of Ohio and resells lasers from Rabbit of China. They have a good reputation in the other forums. Rabbit USA has machines made to their specifications and standards, then opens them up in Ohio and does QC inspection/refinements before shipping to customers. They require you to have to one of their techs come out and do an install for you. Boss Laser is another company out of Florida that sells lasers using the the same business model. You pay a lot more than buying direct from China or Ebay but you have US based-support if you need it and theoretically many of the bugs are worked out of the machine before you get it. Tradeoffs, tradeoffs, tradeoffs...
80 Watt 700mm x 500mm Ke Hui KH-7050 Laser (Similar to the Red Sail),T.R.
LaSea/EFR F2 Series laser tube, RuiDa RDC6442G EC controller, 2" lens, RDWorks v8.01.18, CW 5000 chiller, Chuck type of rotary attachment
Doug

User avatar
fred ungewitter
Posts: 356
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2016 2:55 pm
Location: East Central FL, USA
Country: USA
Nickname: fred
Laser Machine Make or Type: Redsail Clone
Laser Power: 60W
Laser Bed Size: 500 x 700
Home Position: TR
RDWorks Version: 8.01.18
Accessories: Chuck style rotary, 30 ma meter, home-spun office water cooler mod, muffin fan anti-condensate blower
Windows Version: Windows 7

Re: fake 60, real 60 or real 80 watt upgrade?

Post by fred ungewitter » Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:04 pm

Rabbit Laser requires a tech to install a laser tube? I suppose that writes them off my possible vendor list. Boss Laser is a hundred bucks more expensive, but if they also require a tech to appear, it means even more expense! If your references are for full machine installation, and not tube replacement, that changes my rejection. I'll pop off an email to the Rabbit Laser people to see what is their response.
fred

Redsail clone 60w 700 x 500 REAL 60w Puri tube
home upper right, chuck type rotary 15000 pulse setting
RDW 8.01.18
Win7

Emblaser A3 4w diode laser
BCN3D Sigma Dual Extruder 3d printer
LMS Mini-mill
Cube 3rd gen 3d printer, universal filament mod
Under construction: OX CNC 1000x750 router

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